May 7 Developer Stream Feedback for TC Octus & Dana Sissons

Hello @TC_Octus I hope everything is going well with you and the team.

I am just putting together some feedback for the May 7 Developer Stream, and I would like to compose a list of things in regards to the questions that you and Dana Sissons asked the community and if you would be so kind as to pass them up the chain to Mr Sissons

1). Tour Items being brought back.

Explanation:

Previous Tour items should be brought back for several reasons, one major reason for this is, there is no argument that can be put forward for these items in regards to achievement. Tour items as they stand, is Time = Items.

In layman’s terms that means, the only thing that is stopping you from getting the items is time, that’s it. There is no difficulty, there is no challenge, it is merely, get here before this time period and grind stars, that’s it.

When Mr Sissons stated that the team wanted “the Tour of Duty items to feel like people were there”, and that “I was there and I did the work to get this”.

This is in stark contrast to what the actual system is though, as at current you are getting kickback because there is no challenge as it is a matter of time only to unlock items, and if you have enough of it to waste on a day, but still there is no challenge.

So where is the challenge part coming from? There isn’t one, so quite rightly the Tour Items need to come back, so that the Tour in its current form can be reiterated and actually make it one of Challenge + Skill = Items, not one of, Time = Items, because you are going to get the response of, "Well the only reason why I did not get (Insert said item), is because of a time limit. That is not right,and it is a feeling of great betrayal of the Gears name because no challenges on the Gears, 1, 2 and 3 games, did we have challenges or unlockables time locked like this with a Battle Pass.

To add on to that as well, you are putting campaign items, Winter and Desert versions, and characters of the main characters that you play as in the campaign in the Tour and the Item Store, (I will get to that after). So in reality it is by no stretch of the imagination that this can be defended, and can not be argued of, “I have this item, therefore I put the work in” because the items are in the campaign, and everyone has already has used said items, and in reality you have created an arbitrary reward system because you have just taken content that should have been available in the base game, (skins, animations, characters),

When those types of unlocks maybe should have been, you complete the story campaign and then you get said items, instead of, this item is exclusive and sought after merely because we will take it away and it won’t come back.

All it is to us is, “here’s the items, get them before x amount of time, or we’ll deny you content”.
I think almost all of the people still playing Gears 5 will demand the Tour items back.

As Mr Sissons stated, “skins like the Red Speaker might not come back, but the other items that were on the Tour exploitatively will be (coming back)” Good, they should be, unfortunately for The Coalition that is a lot of items that needs to come back.

Here is another problem though. If you put any item on the Tour, and it is an item that was accessible in the previous Gears games and you have locked it to people that just so happen to miss the Tour or not have enough time to put into the Tour, you are going to get flak for it, and it appears to be the vast majority of people at the moment, and quite rightly so because there is nothing that could be argued as “Rare, or highly coveted” simply because you have stuck it behind a locked door, put a time limit on it, thus creating an artificial rarity that does not work, hence why all the feedback of players saying scrap the whole thing.

What I would put to you is, everything in the previous Tour Operations up until now, should, and need to be brought back, and for the future Tour Items, re-create the system.

As stated on the stream you guys are putting in the effort and that you have listened to fan feedback, and that you are going to spend this time changing and fixing mechanics and adding content that should have been there from the start, as you stated in the Stream, so I think you need to apply the same stance with the other mechanics that are in this game.

Solution:

Get rid of the Battle Pass style Tour and re-create it from scratch with new elements and mechanics.

An example of this is the Road to Recon to what Bungie did for the Recon Armour.
To progress with the tour you have to complete challenges that require actual skill, not time limits.
These do not need to be so hard that people can not progress through the Tour but they can be and I will touch on that in a minute.

Make the challenges go hand in hand with the Gears of War style. Create challenges that relate to the weapons and mechanics that the player has access to, and not something that they can not control, i.e, time.

There is no enjoyment in that regard, other than, “I just managed to get this item because I had an hour left”
Going back to what I was saying about the challenge difficulty. The Tour challenges can be hard because, you will ONLY be putting in items that are not of the base game, nor content from the previous games, but content that has not been seen before, an example, a flaming headed RAAM, like the flaming Recon helmet from Halo 3.
A Black Elite Drone with Red Eyes etc, these rewards will actually be coveted and wanted and rare because they will actually be hard to achieve, and it will be content that does not detract from the average player, i.e, making Scared JD a Tour reward is not the way to go.

The Tour does not need to have 30 levels to make it a challenge, that’s the first thing, the second thing is, only put things on the tour that can be well argued that they are actually coveted because of how hard they are to get and how good they look, i.e, NEW creations, not pre-existing items that people already own in Gears 4, or previous games (Yes you could do a RAAM with a flaming head because that has never been seen before, but putting Desert Dell in the Tour is not)

These NEW items that will not detract from content that should have been in the game. (Classic Baird, Deebee Baird, Scared JD).

The community is here, and plenty of us have good ideas on what the challenges could be, and what type of challenges to do, Gears 2 and 3 are a good starting point, make it mean something for us to earn these items, otherwise the outcome is going to be the same, and that is not good for anyone.

If you want to put Weapons skins in the Tour, I would make them like the Onyx skins from Gears 3 type of thing, but if you are going to go with this system as I have detailed it out above, you shouldn’t really be putting in Blood Splatters, Icons or anything like that, because you will be creating a New Tour system that is one of challenge and not time, so make the rewards actually mean something.

Lastly, get rid of the time limit all together.
Because the Tour system as detailed above, is now one of challenge and skill and not time, there is no need for a time limit because you will earn the items if you have the skill, so a time limit is not needed. You can still bring out new Operations, and New Tour Challenges, but you will still need the skill to unlock the rewards.

Also, the player count is abysmal here in Europe, so why, would you put content on a time limit, when people come and go, like myself who only picked up Gears 5 the other week, why should new people, and old, be punished from access content, simply because, the game was never on our radar, or, we decided to avoid the game because of the negativity surrounding it, i.e, things like this.

Based on the Stream, it sounded like you guys wanted to change, so let us make it a time for change and fix this.

Here is a video by a friend of mine GowTac-Com who details and explains another system for the Tour in great detail:

Gears 5 Cosmetics & Unlocks Feedback - Part 3: Tour of Duty https://youtu.be/rfYn8QTXvz4

Gears 5 Cosmetics & Unlocks Feedback - Part 4: Challenges & Unlocks https://youtu.be/JCzHWyZdiI0

This is it for the Tour segment, and now onto the Item Store.

The Item Store:

1). The current Item Store is focused around timed FOMO (fear of missing out), if The Coalition is indeed wanting to go with a Microtransaction based income, why have they gone down the current route which actually nets you a loss in in-come?

The store needs to be replaced with a full cosmetic store, where anyone can buy any of the items that would have been in the timed store as it is now, without the time limits and restrictions.

The New item store should contain content that has been vaulted by the item store, this includes things such as, the Campaign skins that were in Tour 1 & 2, (JD’s Scared skin, Del’s Winter Skin etc), and previous store content that was on the store at the start of the year, and previous weeks and months.

2). The Store should be a fully fledged Storefront, where we can select a character from an index, and it has all of the skins available for that character, The same goes for selecting weapons, it should have all of the skins for that weapon for us to purchase. (The same goes for Executions, Banners, Blood Splatters).

These videos here can explain another alternate to this situation as well.

Gears 5 Cosmetics & Unlocks Feedback - Part 2: Paid Items: https://youtu.be/JjmKinCF9Fc

If you have managed to get to this point, I thank you very much for your dedication on ready my post.
I thought long and hard about what I was going to write, and I have spent the best part of over an hour looking for spelling mistakes xD

I am a big fan of the Gears of War series, after all, I have been playing since Gears of War 1 came out, so I really do hope and wish, that these issues that we as a community have, that they get the serious attention that is needed, and they get looked at and fixed. At the end of the day we as fans we have no issues with paying for content to support the game, no one has argued against that, however there is a mutual understanding with that, and a line of respect that comes with that, so I hope things can be changed for the better, and that people do decide to come back and play the game again, both new and old, but that can only happen if we see these changes, and The Coalition instead of bringing out new changes or changing anything in general, they should speak to the fans first, because I dare say, almost all of this could have been avoided pre-launch.

The Coalition need not be afraid to interact with us, because as Mr Sissons said, “It’s all about Transparency”, the problem is though with transparency, you need to get the discussion out there early with the understanding that it will change.The Coalition has made lot of changes that fans disagree with, but if those ideas has been established and put out to the fans first, some feedback could have been gained, and things would have turned out differently.

Stop being afraid to float ideas out to get feedback. It does not matter if it is an idea that might not even see the light of day, or things that are behind closed doors, get the feedback from the people who are actually playing your game, and are willing to spend more money on it, this is all we as fans are saying.

Thank you for taking the time to read this, and I wish you all the best, and I am looking forward to what the next few weeks and months bring us.

Thank you again, take care,
Kindest Regards, Mini.

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Oops, I thought the stream had been cancelled. Time to watch it!

For everyone who wants to watch it:

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Imo, they need to stop playing the games for these feedback streams. It doesn’t seem professional at all. They can have streams where they’re playing with the community but it shouldn’t be the main way they address feedback. Think about how much can be accomplished if Octus wasn’t getting sweaty and Dana say “uhhh” every 5 minutes.

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Anything good?

Totally agree with you bud 100 percent they need to make weapon and character skins obtainable for every one especially campaign character skins for multiplayer and escape and horde

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Yes, i totally agree with you, and so the esports store included, Cause if i can’t play for a month i can Miss a lot of items i am interested.

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“Scared JD.”

I DO agree that the Tour and store shouldn’t be timed. I also agree that CAMPAIGN ITEMS shouldn’t be timed, either. Although I feel like this change you’re proposing is pretty drastic. They could simply just let you craft a previous tour with scrap, and finish the challenges. Basically like the totems.

I reached General in every tour so far, and I honestly don’t care if other people can do ot later. That’s actually a… I don’t wanna say “consumer friendly,” since you’re not paying for this (you shouldn’t be), It’s the way it should be.

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Yeah that’s another option I think would be pretty good.
I was just sort of brainstorming ideas and options.
I think TC has enough people working for them to come up with a better alternative going forward, and I think the idea you brought up is a good idea as well, maybe one they should consider.

I do like that they said they are looking into re-adding the ability for people to get previosu Tour Items, so we shall seen in the coming months.

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