KOTH Improvements / Feedback Thread

Hey Everyone,

I wanted to make a thread for the devs to reference that specifically relates to MP KOTH. As this is the only game type I play (well, 95% of the time), there are a number of tweaks and improvements that I think would make it a much more enjoyable experience - I’d like to know what you other KOTH players think as well.

NOTE The purpose of this thread is not about gunplay mechanics and server connections. Rather, constructive ideas on how to make the KOTH game type better… i.e. “I think there should be a sniper at X Location on X map instead of a Dropshot because of (insert reason)”

So… my personal feedback:

  • I’ll get a popular one out of the way and say that Flash Grenades should be a pickup weapon. The way the spawns are set currently, paired with a 10 second or less respawn counter make the Flash Grenade wayyyyy too OP. As a note, I’d like to say that I don’t think the weapon itself should be nerfed - I think it does what it’s supposed to do - I’d just like to see it removed from the starting loadout in KOTH.

  • Spawn Placements - The spawn placements in KOTH need serious tweaking - I really don’t have a problem with a 10 second respawn timer due to the size of the maps, but when enemies are spawning RIGHT NEXT TO THE CURRENT HILL, it is virtually impossible to defend, as you are getting wave after wave of newly respawned players, with fresh loadouts (FLASH OUT!!!)

Here are just a couple of specific examples, but there are many more:

VASGAR: On the (now) Incendiary / Frag Hill, the other team will spawn either just past the sniper staircase on the near side (5 sec from ring) or down the “back alley” facing the other way (8 sec from ring). That means, that an enemy that you’ve killed can potentially get back to the ring in about 7-10 seconds from the time of death, assuming a 1-3 second respawn. There is also what seems like a random spawn all the way at the Retro / Hammerburst hill (days away)
ICEBOUND: On the side grenade hills, the enemy team will spawn more often than not at the near-side Boltok, while your own teammates will spawn far-side, essentially penalizing you for killing them, as they will beat your teammates back to the hill.
2 Examples is enough, but, you get the general gist - every map has similar issues on specific hills.

  • Respawn Timer - If the spawns are too much of a pain in the ■■■ to adjust from a dev point of view, then please at least consider a 15 second respawn counter. This would at least help to give teams a couple of extra seconds to prepare for the inevitable “close spawn flash barrage”.

Anyway, these are just a couple of my personal issues to get the thread started - I’m curious to hear what other KOTH improvements you’d like to see and I’m sure we can add to the list.

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KOTH is atrocious in this game. I told someone on here that I just don’t feel like this is a KOTH game and that is with me having played tens of thousands of KOTH matches in the franchise.

Good points.

This is something that people don’t understand

If possible, you just gotta make them sit back and duck your lancer fire.

What happens is that it is impossible when your teammates rush out to die. Hill then gets flooded with flashbangs and then repeat it on the other side.

Every map plays so strangely with spawns and constant flashing.

My concern with the flashbangs being taken out is that some of the hills are impossible to push without a flash.

The design of the maps is just so campy, and in some maps even a perfect flashbang will not help you cut the distance required to go break the ring.

I have gotten several quints+ due to this. 7-8 kills really fast due to the fact that I kill them and they spawn immediately.

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I think map design is the biggest challenge for koth.

I’d like to see less camping - more ways to combat certain areas where you cannot move at all. Maybe more boltoks and markzas and that would be yikes

Flashbang, maybe it should not blind just stun or blind but not stun. I’ve seen those ideas be thrown around. I’m not sure how I feel about those but I’d just like the smoke to be used more.

Take District for example, that embar/t-bow hill is so lame. Icebound frag hill? same. Asylum train hills? Ugh. Vasgar middle hill or lancer gl/retro(?) hill? bunker dropshot hill?

Smoke grenades must be used there but no one uses them lol.

all blood drive and gridlock type of hills in those maps mentioned.

Then you have the side hills in bunker and training grounds which are impossible to break.

What I’m trying to get at is that KOTH in Gears 5 is one of these three:

  1. hills that are stalemates
  2. hills that are broken every millisecond with a solar flare of flashbangs
  3. hills that are unbreakable
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This is a good point and really something that I wish more KOTH players would understand. If even 1 out of 5 on your team has smoke equipped, it can help cut down on some of those lancer lines.

This is a good, concise, way of describing - I think with a couple of hill placement and spawn adjustments, the maps could be better utilized for KOTH. I’m just not sure what exactly those adjustments should be.

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Some good points made in this thread and agree with most of them.

Flash bangs should be a pick ups like shock grenades, it is very annoying in certain hills getting a constant barrage of flash grenades, it doesnt really add anything to the gameplay.

Certain maps work really well in KOTH in this game in my opinion such as district, asylum and some people might not agree but exhibit which is probably my favourite map in KOTH as I’ve had a lot of tense, close games on that map. I’m not a fan of icebound however and don’t think this map should be in rotation in the king of the hill game mode.

I always have smokes… I love it how it surprised people now, since no one expects them :slight_smile:

I noticed, after the update, I can no longer change my loadout between spawns, only at the start of the round… WTF… So if I miss it at the start, I’m stuck with a flashbang for the whole round…

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lol, a perfect description…

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that bug is back from the tech test? ugh.

omg I haven’t noticed that yet - I’ll pray that bug doesn’t hit me, as I’ll usually only switch to smokes for certain hills.

yeah, can’t do that anymore, based on what I saw last night… I kept hitting Y to change my load out when spawning back, but nothing happened, and that display which tells you to hit Y to change load out was done… (I’m on classic alt, might be a different key on default).

I specifically looked for it after that, and yeah, it was gone, except at the start of the round.

My suggestions to KoTH to reduce the amount of Leavers

  • Make KoTH single round 210 points to give matches averages of 10 minutes. ATM a single match of KoTH Last 17 to 20 minutes people just get bored and leave or afk. Even more when the match have 3 rounds and the game last 30 minutes

  • Lancer damage should be reduced on KoTH only to avoid people camp using 4 lancers the points. KoTH is the mode where you go super offensive with the shotgun to practice ur mechanicals atm just feel a “Lancer-Camp” festival

I dont mind Guardian, TDM and execution is a lancer camp carnaval but on KoTH no…

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I get way more 1v1 gnasher on exe than any other modes. It is probably because of the comp settings and the weapons are detuned a bit and make it more enjoyable and competitve as well. I just wish that they should put exc in a best of 4 instead of 7. It takes way too long to finish a game and if you have quitters…well you are in for a long boring time!

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Exhibit is the only map thats fun for KoTH imo.

Yeah the duration of the TDM, GUARDIAN, KoTH and execution should last 10 minutes “AVERAGES”

Escalation should have best to 5 for “Playerbase” and best to 13 ONLY for E-SPORT or private matches TEAM VS TEAM on an scrim.

Sadly KoTH lasting 20 - 30 minutes & escalation 45 minutes are dead modes for most of the playerbase on 2019

I agree 1000% on flash bangs being removed from the loadout and placed on the map. It is a non stop spam of grenades because if you kill someone they spawn almost instantly and (since the spawns are awful too) right next to the objective and continue the grenade spam.

I think the biggest improvement would be to removed the “team spawning” aspect where as soon as the first person dies, it starts a countdown and anyone who dies in that period will spawn in with the first person who died. This needs to be removed, as there is little to no reward for clearing out enemies when they will be back on the hill within 10 seconds of being killed. (kind of confusing but basically this allows the majority of players to respawn in almost instantly after being killed)

They need to implement the respawn time of escalation into king of the hill, so when you die your respawn will always be 10-15 second or whatever it is.

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I also feel they need some changes to spawn protection. People will spawn with a direct line of site to the enemies, and can be doing damage within 1 second of spawning. If you try to shoot back they are immune to damage.

PLEASE, if someone shoots it should eliminate their spawn protection time.

I actually had no idea that this was how they were doing it - I always assumed players were spawning in with every 10 second increment on the game clock. I’ve even sat on downs for a second to try to time the clock and give the person the full spawn counter (dirty, I know).

but, yeah - if this is how they’re doing it, then that DEFINITELY needs to go…

I have two gripes with KoTH…which are what OP laid out in the opening post. Flash grenades give me a headache and are just 1000% not fun or strategic to play around. But we all seem to agree on that, no need to rehash.

On spawns…we don’t talk about this nearly enough. It feels like I’m just always fighting, it never stops. And that’s because people spawn so close to the hill. It feels that way anyway. It’s hardly a challenge to siege the hill, which in turn makes defending it frustrating. The game mode just isn’t fun anymore.

This while thing of “we just killed the whole enemy team attaching our ring, and look, after 2 seconds they respawned next to the ring, with spawn protection, and are throwing flashbangs” is incredibly NOT fun…

I would really like for TC to provide a more detailed explanation of what determines the rank points for each round, and any changes they have in mind for the future. My final KOTH last night had me +180 in round 1 (narrow win), -400 in round 2 (narrow loss), and +40 in round 3 (180-0 win). Tied for most elimination on my team, 3rd place in overall points, and de-ranking by around 200 rank points overall. How does it make sense to lose ten times as many rank points for the losing round than you gain for the 180-0 round? If the punishment for the losing round is so extreme, shouldn’t the gain for a dominant 180-0 win be commensurate? In the overall match, I was tied for most elimination on my team, and 3rd place in score. I wasn’t carrying by any means, but I was at a minimum holding my own and contributing my fair share toward the win. This isn’t news to anyone, but something seems incredibly off about the way rank points are determined.