Infiltrator specific questions and leghty explanation

This is NOT me asking for cards to run on Infiltrator. Instead, me with some specific questions I have about said class, with lengthy explanations that provide context.

After creating my attack Jack questions post, and realizing I wasn’t clear at all in some points of it (tried reading it afterwards and was confused on some points) , I am going to summarize it in 6 questions, then proceed to explain said points :stuck_out_tongue:

A) Perks. Does perking up Health mean your Stim capacity goes up?

B)Perks. Is perking up movement really early worth it?

C) Isn’t Stim supposed to be guarantee to live for one hit of anything? (Boomshot Scions)

D) Wave 31 and afterwards. Tips for not being a little bit of a hindrance for the team at that point?

E) Is getting an Overkill from Engi no longer a thing?

F) Be honest. Don’t you guys believe 60% dmg resistance is a little bit broken?

Now, to explain said questions…

A) Assuming each characters’ HP is… For example I think it was 1200 points. And Stim capacity is 220%, if I perk up my health, would my Stim capacity go up as well? (I.e having 1800 health points would mean I am getting more Stim than if I had the base 1200 points with no perks). Asking because this is what seems most obvious to me, but I have misunderstood perks before (like Demo, I thought Assault Riffle perks counted towards GL rockets but apparently it doesn’t.) If it doesn’t go up,and said perk only counts when you don’t have Stim, I think there’s really no point perking health up because you are supposed to be under Stim 99% of the time.

B) Personally I’ve never found the point in upgrading movement with Infiltrator, at all. If anything, I only do so once the base is done and Energy is no longer a factor in our game. I do it just because I suppose it’s better than just put in Fabricator where it won’t be used. However in seeing other Infiltrators, sometimes since waves 5-6 I can see they’ve perked some speed movements, and that’s pretty clear to the rest of the team. What am I missing here? Personally, without any speed perk, I charge at drones/DR-1s/Grenadiers who are shooting at me, don’t go down due to the 60% dmg resistance, and shoot at em to get more Stim. Rinse and repeat. Seriously, don’t see the point of more speed. Unless I’m missing something.

C) This one is short. I assumed Stim = any hit survival. Yet I know if a Boomshot hits me, I am going down. Do Boomshots override said rule of Stim = survivability? Not complaining, I like the risk of still being able to go down.

D) Talking about going down… Once hit wave 31 (and 2x damage venom) starts, I can no longer go out and kill stuff, especially if the enemies are the robots. I just go down too quickly due to Enforcers. At this point in the match I usually switch to build a Repair tool (wave 31. Base should be ready, energy should be plentiful etc.) and help Engi repair and/or reload sentries. Only take out the Gnasher if something like a Grenadier is close. If I see a claw I know I cannot kill it, unless really close when I’m in cover. Sometimes I use the ult just to get some Elite drones quickly meat shielded, but that’s it. Also I kill Guardians /Sentinels with my Ultimate. During boss waves, and due to the dmg resistance, I usually stay in base in case Demo/Tactician go down or in the unlikely case we get overrunned I can use ult to quickly get rid of the enemies inside the base. But in a team of good players, neither of these 2 happens so I am just help Engi repair. :stuck_out_tongue:

E) Talking about engies, Is swapping your Retro Lancer (assuming there’s no Veteran on the match) for their Overkill no longer the thing to do? Personally if I’m Infiltrator, I appreciate the extra 20 (40 in reality) shots from the Overkill, and I try to rotate both weapons so a single ammo box can keep me up top ammo with both. And if I’m the Engi, I appreciate the Retro simply because it’s an instant execution on Rejects/Drones etc. But I am having difficulties with engis giving me their Overkill. And if I’m the Engi, Infiltrator doesn’t come at me. If I go there and offer to swap weapons, they outright ignore me and only use their Gnasher all the time, lol.

F) Don’t know, outright 60% dmg resistance + instant Stim always sounds a little bit too good lol. Reminds me of Cole in Escape when he just came out. I remember being able to master all hives (not alone, I am not as good as Commander for example) released to that point using Cole with all resistance cards. I think I had like 90% dmg resistance if running, outright immune to melee (so no Wardens dmg or Scions I could simply run to them to force them to melee instead of shooting, I was inmune to Juvies at Warren) when ult was ready, Infiltrator seems pretty similar in Horde, I can, unless there are Sires who can grab me, just carry the first 30 waves with my resistance. If anything, only the helicopter boss is immune to me, lol. I am not an expert in game balancing, but how is this a thing?

And about D-F. Just another thing that amazes me, from waves 1-29 I can carry the thing, then once we hit wave 31 a flip switches and I am no longer doing that much, lol. Of course this is just me, and surely other people who use the class better than me surely can stay alive out there even waves 41+ (dmg taken is 2.5x)

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Certainly feels like it.

Yes.

Boomshots have 2 explosions, the first will take off your stim, the 2nd your life.

Don’t suck and cloak when there are too many Drones / you lose stim.

Just ask, what kind of question is this?

Absolutely. WE SHOULD NERF EVERYTHING. FUN IS FORBIDDEN.

Mod edit: Feel free to disagree but cursing at people isn’t ok.

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I’m about 95% sure that health doesn’t affect stim capacity. As I understand it, all characters have a standard stim capacity which can be filled which is pretty small. If you want more stim, then you’d need the Stim Batteries card equipped.

Stim and health don’t overlap per se, so a high damage shot will strip away the stim, but won’t eat into your health. Only a subsequent attack will do this. So for example lets say that you have 1000 health and 500 stim. An enemy melee delivers 1200 damage, in this case it would take away your stim, but not any of your health.

With Boomshots, I’ve seen there sometimes be a secondary explosion. I’m not totally sure but I presume was from an active reload. I guess hypothetically a Boomer may be able to use an active Boomshot to down you despite having stim - the main shot takes out your stim, and the secondary knocks you down. I’m not as certain on this though. But normally stim enables you to tank a Boom.

Movement speed - this is usually the last perk I upgrade too. It’s alright to use. Sometimes it helps to have the extra speed to rush and flank enemies and clsoe the gap, especially with the limited bleed range.

Weapon loadout - I always use the Overkill (as well as the Gnasher). I don’t see much benefit in keeping the Retro. I typically don’t buy an Overkill though - they’re plentisome on the battle field so I just wait until certain enemies appear.

With Enhanced Stim and damage resistance, yeah Infiltrator is pretty tanky nowadays. It relies on momentum and chaining shotgun and shotgun bleed kills though. You’re not invincible though, so still be careful, and unlike the Brawler, your crowdcontrol ability is much less - you might be able to hit 2 or 3 enemies with a shotgun depending on the distance and their positions, but I guess this limitation compensates from a balance perspective too. On master a single melee from a Drone will take out most of your stim (depending on how much you’ve built up if you have the capacity card on). Salvo rockets will also take out most if not all of your stim too. I guess from a design perspective, it’s balanced by the fact you have to be at very close range to bleed enemies.

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No, they are Both Different System. The stim capacity won’t be the same as the Health Bar.

No, it’s not necessary unless you’ve Max Perk on Shotgun. Movement Speed is about personal Play Style, but Damage Perk is always the Top Priority to upgrade with first. This shouldn’t be any arguable for Worth or not.

If your Stim is big enough, you can eat a Boomshot, but you can’t eat a Dropshot if the Dropshot headshot you.

Wait them to come and kill. Use your Flashbang if neceesary. Use your Ultimate for DR-1 or Enemies that you think is in Top Priority

You don’t need to rely Overkill in early wave. An 2000 Energy doesn’t mean very much if the Engineer doesn’t want to change it to you. This shouldn’t be a Problem unless you miss a lot of shots in your Gnasher. Just need to use Gnasher to Practice and go for perfect in every Shot in Wave 30 before or Wave 8.

Broken, but you still have Question towards later wave (31 Waves), so this Broken Thing needs Skill a lot.

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Kaits execution build is still very much viable. You could try running that instead to be more useful after wave 31.

I’m not going to answer every specific question or anything, but I’ll give an Infiltrator 101 class.

Infiltrator is one of the most difficult classes to master, the reason it is this way is because A) there are no easy ‘cheese’ methods ala a Tactician/Demo combo, and B) its almost 100% predicated on ability to dodge/outmaneuver enemies and being able to close distance and gib Swarmies.

I know folks are gonna call me out on this but there is ZERO reason why a player couldn’t benefit from understanding how to wallbounce/gnasher, here’s a video.

Although the Infiltrator on the surface level may very well be a fairly straightforward melee type class the reality is that there is a massive skillgap to it and there is no ‘wallbounce’ card you can just equip, you have to practice lots because 1 small mistake and you are taking an early trip to hell.

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Once the Map is Huge, it’s not Worth at all.

It’s a creative Build, but it tends to play passively once you don’t have the Ultimate. And if you somehow cannot find many Enemies and may suck in going down, which is another disadvantage in this Build.

Same here, I could tell it does… however next 2 people who answered said it doesn’t…

What are your advantages on using said speed perk?

I mean, I shouldn’t be tanking as many claw hits as I am with 60% resistance. And I am taking out the fun from the teammates back at base who want to kill enemies. Perhaps something like a 32% resistance at level 6 should be more fun/good for skilled people. But as it currrently is, I know I can launch myself to the fight field and just tank everything. Like Cole when he launched in Escape. Where’s the fun in that? Where’s the skill required if I know I am just not going to die? (unless Sires) Besides, I am killing everything before it gets to base, essentially ruining the fun for the team if they are back there. Last night for example I saw a Combat Medic who originally had a Trishot but given I was taking stuff out, he stored it and just sit back. I know he was still active because he was still depositing, but how was it fun for him ?

Same goes for example for the Tactician/Demolitions combo of meatshielding everything. Could argue it takes skill, but at the end of the day all it does is making Demo kill 90% of enemies, leaving the rest of the players nothing to do. Perhaps if someone needs a carry that’s cool, but what if they just want to have fun killing stuff but can’t because Infi is just killing everything before it goes to base?

That explains it, thanks!

This is what I don’t understand. People keep telling me this, yet I know I can just go for whatever is there (first 30 waves) and not go down. And for me, there’s no skill involved if I know I am just tanking stuff.

I guess it does take skill (that I don’t have) after wave 31 in order to keep playing as recklessly. But argue that first 30 even someone who isn’t that skillfull (like myself) can still carry the thing.

To be fair, I always have Stim Batteries (and Enhanced Stim on anyway. It’s just my experienced with other classes like Mac/Anchor - the extra health doesn’t feel like it makes any (or much difference). I only play master difficulty, so it’s probably hard to gauge because you take lots of damage anyway, and I have to admit I’ve not gone out of my way to test it in any detail. I could be wrong.

Well, it’s my experience since Most of them won’t Perk Health for testing the Stim Capacity first, so I think we can have some test from it in Early Wave.

If you Perk Health in Later Wave like Me, it seems the same, which only increase the Health only, but I can’t confirm whether it increases the Stim Capacity also.

There’s definitely some level of skill involved. The bleed range is so small now that you need to find ways to get close to enemies; and on later Horde waves they can come in large numbers and are accurate shooters. With movement and wall-bouncing, I can’t see the benefit of hyper bouncing or wall-bouncing in the same way as high-ish level PVP players do it, but I find you need to be able to “bounce” in a different many - using the cover-mechanic to slide closer to enemies for the attack; sliding away to retreat; rolling off and around cover to escape fields of fire and to flank. It’s a different approach for sure, but it still requires some level of skill. I think it relies more on spatial awareness and decision making so you can evade enemies, retreat and plan your next strike. Plus as I said, it’s about momentum of kills. If you can’t build up enough stim, then you can’t take as many hits before it’s gone. Sometimes all it takes is a team mate launching a Boomshot at an enemy you caused bleed to, and all of a sudden that enemy becomes your team mate’s kill and you lose out on a bit of stim. I try to be as evasive as possible even on earlier waves just in case. Tanking damage is more of a plan B for me.

There’s a reason PvP players hop on this class

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When you know those Enemies are AI with aimbot, and play the Gnasher in a PvP way.

The Elite Drones laughed “He’s a Donkey” :face_with_hand_over_mouth:.

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its beautiful :sob:

Like seriously, you have no idea how much I love Infiltrator lol. I don’t use them all the time because they make things kind of easy but still.

Some people like to keep a distance, helps them cope with all the people they’ve murdered… I on the hand like to look them in the eyes as they depart into the afterlife :joy_cat:

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No. The class has a high skill cap to be useful in the hands of a player. If you think the 60% is too much, how about taking it off or the Stim Batteries and seeing if you still think it’s so “OP”? You want all the survivability you can get against the enemies especially on Master Horde.

Speed boost is very useful to close the distance and not lose too much of your stim. And you want to outrun a Sentinel’s Salvo barrage then slap it silly from underneath the shield when your cloak isn’t ready but the flyer is within the bleed range? Get your speed boost perk maxed out.

Use covers, situational awareness, limit how many enemies are shooting at you at the same time, but don’t stray too far or as others have said, use your cloak. And you have flashes available too. Also don’t forget, currently due to some potentially wonky implementation - unless this was stealth fixed or I missed it in the patch notes of the last update - Reaper provides stim on any kill so long as you hold a shotgun.

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Thus far, the only people who aren’t able to play as good as myself (in fact, play better than myself) are people who run the cards focused on the ultimate. If you run the dmg resistance, there’s not really any skill involved.

Under that premise, couldn’t you argue the same about other classes? Like taking Custom Boomshots from Demo if they feel they are good? Or Thrill of the Hunt from Swordsmaster if they feel good without that resistance? Or Jack’s Rampage if they feel good themselves?

Thanks. These are the tips I wanted to know about seeing so many people running around max speed early on. :slight_smile:

It has been like this at least since Infiltrator’s cards swapped to the current meta. I know that I can just melee enemies (like Imagos or regular Drones) then execute them (while holding a Gnasher) to get stim. Also while executing I am imune to all damage (including a Boomshot from a Scion) and afterwards I have tons of more stim, while having took no damage, and not using any ammo to make your teammates use the ammo boxes. Stuff like this makes me more secure in saying this class doesn’t require skill… Unless you pressing B B LONG B counts as skill :stuck_out_tongue:

Idk, the speed-boost provided by the perk to close gaps/get away from enemies? It’s self explanatory. Get it to 4 before Wave2 and to 5 after it and finish it once Damage and Health are maxed out.

It’s literally Shotgun-Lahni. Kill to stay alive That’s the fun.

Stop. Lying. You either don’t play Master or you know something I don’t know. A single Melee-hit will still take away all your stim in 1 hit, same with Grenadiers in later waves ( often from a distance) and Scions will still wipe the floor with you if they catch you offguard. Especially Ice Scions.

Like maybe 5-6 during higher waves? Not to mention that Elite Drones are never isolated and there are always multiple enemies around.

Also; what is everyones obsession with these god-damn drones? Did they make jokes about everyones mom?

their fault for playing that ■■■■■■ class and getting bored, not yours.

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This is Frenzy, right? lol. 99% of my playtime with Infi is all normal Horde related, I don’t know much of the class in Frenzies. Basically because the 2x damage kicks in super early and I am not as good under that.

I mean… if you want to, we can play some Horde (regular) me as Infi, you as something else (or Infi ) to see how I can just tank stuff and kill stuff without going down.

Gotta give you the point here. Ice Scions do kill Infiltrator. Unless I have the Ult and use the Shoot there. :stuck_out_tongue:

Personally I remember back when the game had just launched, their Claw made everything go down in just a couple hits, so that’s why I made a reference to being able to resist their hits.

:rofl:

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I have a question is the passive glitched or changed?

Played a frenzy on inc every boss I tried to shoot out of the ultimate gave me the same base damage as the gnasher every time

Are you sure you used the Gnasher bullet to get out of the Ultimate? and that it hit on the enemy?

Last night I was able to One-shot Devastators and Ice Scions coming out of the Ultimate, so for me it seems as if it’s working as usual.