Icebound on Master, who needs JD, Del, Baird or Kait when you can just do it without them

We tried without Jack but somewhat messed it up. Without Jack, this map is a different story. :slight_smile: (I’m not saying impossible) We’ve done the “no-Jack” run on Vasgar. That one will be published later.

Unfortunately we couldn’t really show off many difficult bosses. The only somewhat difficult boss we got was the Kestrel but as always, stunning effects with Clayton make that one a joke.

The Vasgar run will involve two Swarmaks and also a Kestrel. It will also be a bit more of an “intense” run than Icebound. Who knows, maybe’ll do Icebound again sooner or later without Jack and maybe even without an Engineer? We don’t know yet.

If you have any questions, please refer to the description of our Training Grounds video first. Otherwise I’m happy to answer them.

Training Grounds run:

This topic is mainly just to prove that the OP characters are not required to beat the most difficult map on Master.

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I would hesitate to qualify Kait as “OP” while Marcus and JD can dominate the field. Powerful? Yes. Capable of wiping the floor with enemies with a low skill requirement and relatively low effort like JD? Not really, besides potentially Cloak which only really works against Drone size enemies.

But someone used Marcus. Some may think Marcus isn’t OP but in my view, he is what makes those difficult runs possible. Recently, I did Marcus on the bridge of Canals, control room of Lift and heavy weapon spawn at the top middle of Reclaimed. Marcus’ auto aim and Stim is what makes those difficult runs and setups to be possible. Without him, those runs would be way harder or maybe not. If someone like Sarah Connor, COG Gear or Emile replaced Marcus, you won’t get to do the auto aim X-Ray.

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This assumption is based on joining random lobbies. I know that you guys know they’re powerful but join as Fahz or Marcus or whatever into a random lobby. The chances you’re kicked are pretty high. This includes Clayton too.
Kait is still very welcome in random lobbies. The point is to show that other characters can carry the game as well unlike JD only.

I was recently talking to a few friends - I hadn’t played with them for a couple of months but I was telling them about how useful Clayton was, and they refused to believe me until I showed them. With the greatest respect, most of that crew are (or were…) subscribers of the JD-Kait-JACK-Del-Horde-Meta Crew. I hope they’ve taken this knowledge away and are trying out other characters as well.

And the best thing is, Clayton really just needs that one Concussive Explosives card. While Reflective Shredder and Heavy Shell are useful, the former only downs people unless you are close to them (so downed enemies can easily get revived anyway) and Heavy Shell is harder to time correctly because explosive weapons are slower to fire, so it’s hard to time activating your ultimate to protect you from both the explosive weapon and the dozens of normal bullet-firing enemies on harder difficulties. I presonally rarely see explosive shells reflected back. At least in Horde. In Escape it’s easier to time it correctly. The other cards are bonuses, but I never found them truly standing out as being incredible.

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Team Resist if timed correctly.

Bait Armor since it stays at 30% defense.

Heavy charger since you’re most likely spaming Salvos anyway.

Ultimate Battery CAN be useful in Escape but isn’t really needed.

Freeze Resist is useful on The Line and Melee Brawl.

The rest is useless though.

I wouldn’t be surprise if TC adjusted the difficulties of enemies when JD is not present or an Engineer, etc.