I would like to emphasize how disappointed I am

I’ve been pretty quiet on these forums as of recently, but with Operation 6 quickly approaching I had started lurking again. Immediately I noticed something felt off, I’m sorry to say it feels like someone had taken all the wind out of this communities sails. This isn’t meant to be a jab, it’s just an observation.

Those of you who know me, know that I often try to see things from all perspectives. It’s not an outright defense of some of TC’s more questionable actions, but instead more of a “let’s find some logic behind this move”. I’m sure being a triple A dev in the new uncharted territory of ‘Games as a Service’ must not easy. Many devs are finding themselves dipping their toes in the water to see what works and what doesn’t. Admittedly, TC has been amongst the most transparent developers (as of recently) in owning their past mistakes and promising better things moving forward. Since Gears 5’s launch, TC has made radical sweeping changes to the very foundation of this game and while it is their job to keep the game being played, we should all be willing to acknowledge their effort and commitment.

All this said… I got to ask… Who wanted Speyer back?

I fully understand each and every one of us have our own favorites and preferred maps and there truly is a map for everyone out there. But come on… Speyer… REALLY? Out of the hundreds upon hundreds of “What is your map wishlist” threads on these forums and reddit, never once did I see another living soul mention Speyer.

I’ve often been the first to point out to TC naysayers that making brand new maps is a TON of work and can take upwards of half a year. So, surely I understand that if the community wants more maps, the quickest way to do so is by bringing over maps from Gears 4. I think many of us have come to peace with this and accept this reality, but still, we have certain expectations.

While I personally have grown very tired of Clocktower, I seen in Gears 4 that it was always being voted for over other maps. This was clearly an indication to TC that the map was highly favored by the community, so bringing it to Gears 5 made sense. However, in the case of Speyer… I am near certain such voting popularity never existed.

So, here we are… A new Operation starting today, an opportunity for a fresh start. Some great new content coming alongside an aesthetically identical version of a map that nobody voted for even when it was brand new in a just released Gears 4.

Can we just get an answer? Among all remaining Gears 4 that have yet to be brought to Gears 5, how was Speyer chosen? There are still 16 Gears 4 maps remaining… Some are obvious favorites, others I am sure the community would never like to see again. Perhaps I’m extremely jaded and Speyer is a welcome addition. Who knows? Well, maybe you guys do…

Of this list of maps, please choose 3 that you’d love to see return and 3 that you never want to see again. This way, a thousand years from now, when future historians look back upon this community and try to figure out why we were so damn disgruntled, they can see this post and use it as evidence in Moon Court.

Avalanche
Dawn
Diner
Drydock
Fallout
Glory
Hotel
Impact
Mercy
Old Town
Raven Down
Relic
Rustlung
Security
The Slab
War Machine

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Maybe and it occurred to them that since it is not a known / widely played map in Gears 4, they could pass it off as a new one, so that novices and those who do not played the previous Gears can swallow the story that the content of the operation It is a “never seen before”.
still, it’s a bad (not to say silly) idea.

You always know it’s going to be a good post when it begins with a defense of why you defend TC.

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I mean, at least they added a new area(?) to Speyer lol

It’s a shame because most of the original maps TC have released post-launch have been really good. I know it takes more effort, but TC have had more hits than misses.

I don’t really want Gears 4 maps ported, but if I had to choose 3…

Dawn, Impact, Diner.

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Please elaborate…

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Dude, its a map, its really not that serious. Its a pretty good map too IMO.

Not the greatest launch of an Operation, I agree, but this is only phase 1 of Op 6.

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Did they? I didn’t notice a new area. It might be just me missing something obvious (it wouldn’t be the first time lol).

I think at least, if not that’s fine by me, a map is a map lol

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I think that the return of G4 maps isn’t bad… if there are little modifications. For exemple : with other hour of the day, different light or wheather… just to change.

thats how returning maps should be, when clocktower came back to gow 4, they modified it and made it look more modern. but they stopped which im not sure why. River looks changed up, they added more detail to it and made it look less grey like how all the gow 2 maps looked but i could notice a difference. its what they shouldve done to reclaimed and foundation, CHANGE THEM UP, Old town in gow 4 had a really cool change too, it became a UIR town and i liked it, it was the same map but it felt like it belonged in gow 4.

going forward TC needs to have a different atmosphere in terms of returning maps, like if gridlock were to return again (sigh) id rather not have it return with the same boring grey. id rather not have gridlock come at all but if it were to come, make it look different. bring back the gow 3 gridlock with the ash people but basically just change the atmosphere.
another tangent; I think they should ask us about returning maps, make a poll and ask us something like: Hey gears community, we are planning on bringing back Jacinto, we wanted to see what you might prefer in terms of how the map looks, do you want it to return to the original look (G2), (G3) or a completely new idea? and we just vote on it. improves community relations and we know what to expect.
thank you for listening to my TED Talk

Judging by the replies it appears that no one read the post. :upside_down_face:

To return:

Old Town
Relic
Hotel or Mercy

Never to be seen again:

Raven Down
Security
Impact

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return
Dawn
Diner
Glory
never to be seen again
The Slab
Security
Relic
the gow 4 maps made by TC should come to 5. it gives us more of TC original maps and possibly we develop a better look on them. for example: I wasnt crazy about relic but if it came back in 5, maybe id like it more. maybe id hate it more. who knows? maps like raven down, gridlock, blood drive, checkout, have already been solidified for many of us as a ¨good map¨ blood drive is controversial but many do like it oddly enough. Ive felt that maps like gridlock and blood drive need to be taken out of commission for a game. Im hoping in gears 6 that they decide to retire maps that continually come back every game and give them a break. or if they are not willing to do that, change the environment like what they did to clocktower in 4.

Im not by all means against old maps, i love old maps. Im glad river came back, its like in my top 5 maps of all time, it holds a lot of sentimental value for me. but id love a revamped thrashball where its DB themed and we see thrashball DBs as in the current lore, DBs are playing in thrashball and Cole runs the show. Thrashball is just an example.

if TC can’t be bothered to do this themselves and avoid another bad map pick then they deserve to get flack for it.

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TC and Microsoft are very stingy with gears imo. Of course the maps situation is one of the fundamental concerns. Barely any maps at launch. My preference is to bring back all or most of the maps from all the games. they can be redesigned and reused. For the survey I am pro raven down war machine slab and anti rustlung drydock.

If it’s a lazy copy paste of maps, the better solution is just add ALL G4 maps… Fast and efficient !

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DAWN
DINER
THE SLAB

I personally would like every map at least since TC took over with Gears 4.

If I had to cut any… It would be FALLOUT and GLORY. Never liked either but maybe horde players would want them anyway or customs?

If these maps have already been made by this team, then I don’t see an issue. ALL should return.
Community would respond better I believe, if every Gears 4 map was ported over and more content promised with time needed.

Or just make Gears Online with multiplayer only. One chosen tuning… :joy: I can see the uproar now… And every map from every gears game.

Fuel Station, old bones, All Fathers Garden, Sanctuary, nowhere, memorial…

If they want to make remakes and focus creative energy on gears 6 then do so and give us plenty of remakes…

So we wouldn’t complain.

Old Town is one of my favorite maps in Gears, so I’d happily take it again.

Diner is probably the best overall map in Gears 4, so I’d happily take that too.

To round out my three, Drydock. Very good Gears 3 map that I wouldn’t mind seeing again.

For my bottom three, absolutely Raven Down, then Dawn and probably Avalanche simply because Speyer can’t be on the list. Avalanche is cool for Execution but since all we have are respawn types now, what use is its gimmick?

No there isn’t. There are only 8 original maps in Gears 4. I’m not typing it up again, I wrote up an extensive comment here, but it’s worse than people think if you want to check it out. Epic did similar.

There’s images (screenshots - with names of the multiplayer maps in each game. with the number of new (green text) vs number of ports (white text).

The two things in Gears 4’s defense for the lopsided new-to-old map ratio, in my mind, are:

  1. Gears 4 wasn’t built on the same engine that Gears 1-J were, and ran on UE4. Recreating old maps took more time than it would have to port it from, say, Gears 1 to 2.
  2. Gears 4 was trying to establish itself as a Gears game after the franchise had been handed over by Epic. It was a game that played things remarkably safe, and I think that extended to their map choices and design.

They also released maps at a much faster pace than Gears 5. So that’s something.