The lancer is way too weak, Looking at these stats, no cards/perks:
Lancer - 206 active headshot damage
Longshot - 7500 active headshot damage
At point blank it takes 36.4 active lancer headshots (almost a full mag!) to equal a single longshot round’s damage. This is compounded by the lancer losing 40% of its damage beyond mid range and having heavy bullet spread. Realistically, you will never land an entire mag on the head even at point blank range, meaning a single longshot round will do more FAR more damage and do it instantly, with no need to stay exposed, with more ease and at any range compared to an entire lancer mag.
This balance is beyond atrocious, and when using characters that don’t have bonus damage or their damage applies to all weapons (eg: slugger), you will always pick a longshot over any other weapon and the lancer lies firmly at the bottom of the pile. Can we get this changed before the game sunsets? More variety would add to the game’s replay-ability imho. I’d like to use automatic weapons more often but feel pigeonholed into longshot only on most classes. If buffing the AR’s damage output makes Veteran overpowered, as a counterbalance a nerf to the ultimate could be warranted in exchange.
My biggest issue with ARs in PvE is the fact that most of them can’t bypass the DBNO state of Drones with headshots. Only the Retro. Why can’t PvE ARs be like PvP Arcade ARs and allow everything to get outright headshot kills?
Yeah, as long as you arent doing any movement animation, as long as you didnt just run out of ammo and your lancer starts to reload, as long as the game doesnt misinterpret you pressing RB to mean you are trying to reload, as long as you dont sustain any damage, including getting hit by a random bullet from the other side of the map, etc, etc, etc…
The change of input processing in G5 from polling to event based and the combining of reload with chainsaw revvup greatly, Greatly, GREATLY destroyed the chainsaw’s viability, both in pvp and pve.
It is, to me, THE stupidest change they made, snd it was obviously a decision made by someone who never actually used the chainsaw in combat, on any regular basic.
That’s the main thing that stops me from using the Claw on Veteran. That and the terrible misfire feature that’s oh-so-fun to try to avoid while reaping the benefits of not needing to reload.
Like OP says if that made Veteran too strong, just tweak the ult to keep it auto-aim and no reload but put less emphasis on headshots (that’s a DPS role, no?) and more on suppression and stopping power.
@Umbral_Tremor, the garbage damage of ARs stings even more when you consider how much recoil these pathetic, damage weapons have.
Mid-range, fire Lancer; you’re probably hitting 2 maybe 3 headshot before you have to ease off the trigger and burst again… Why do people prefer the Hammerburst over the Lancer again…? (Rhetorical but I’ll still answer it), because it basically does the same amount of damage, is more accurate and does the “skillful” part for you.
Why does my PvE Lancer have PvP-tuned damage and bloom? Laziness? Certainly not…
As much as I agree with you and would welcome this I can’t see it happening. PvE was basically done after Op5 and now the game proper is just as done.
The main issue is that there is only one rifle class, and without rifle-specific buffs, other weapons outshine rifles greatly. The other issue is that the Veteran Ultimate literally has the game play itself, so it’s not terribly satisfying if your goal is to play the game with rifles.
Living Legend shouldn’t autoaim. Recoilless shots with a damage buff would have been a lot better.
A small universal rifle damage buff in horde would probably be fine.
The Lancer does less damage, however comes with an insta-kill type of attack via chainsawing which is great against Sires for instance and can prevent classes like Blademaster to be executed in CQC via a Cyclops with a Lancer in hand. So the Lancer itself has other benefits, shooting-damage isn’t necessarily meant to be its main-purpose I suppose. It’s a neat secondary weapon for Combat Medic as well with all the damage buffs it gets (+30% from Passive, +60% from card, + 100% from perks).
Retrolancer is fine imo. Similar to the Lancer, however a bit stronger and can insta-headshot.
Lancer GL is pretty strong too and has the trade-off for a small mag to balance it (or the GLs obviously which are ridiculous).
Hammerburst is probably the worst and only really beneficial on a Brawler with burning rounds since you basically have unlimited ammo with that thing, at least in Horde.
Enforcer can be great in Escape e.g. on a Mechanic, in Horde not so much since it’s a close-ranged weapon and for Horde there’s better ways to deal with enemies in CQC. I guess it’s also more like a SMG than an AR technically?
Claw is probably more like a LMG and in a good state already imo.
This is of course annoying and I’m pretty sure execution rules were removed from the default mutator settings for this very reason, so I don’t see it as much of an issue any more. Sure, it still pops up on the daily but you are expected to work around those. That said, I would definitely welcome any buff and popping heads with ARs in arcade does feel very satisfying after dealing with the peashooter ARs in horde.
While it is true the chainsaw can be handy, it’s not a great excuse to make the gun its attached to almost completely worthless. In its current state you may as well just delete the lancer and replace it with an equippable chainsaw.
Would rather use the claw you spawn with for this.
None of the AR’s are fine, their damage output is bad across the board and on top of that they all have their own uniquely harsh downsides: The retro has obsecene bloom and recoil with a small mag and long reload time. The GL has heavy recoil, loses HALF of its damage past mid range, and has long and frequent reloads. The Hammerburst is basically a Lancer without the chainsaw (ie: worst primary in the game), The claw is definitely by far the best of the bunch at stock level but it’s just a chore to use, I wouldn’t enjoy using it even if it pumped more dps than the longshot (which it is nowhere near to).
I’d rather run around with the Maze lol but yea definitely. I’m just saying they have other benefits which are often overlooked. With the Lancer you can trigger it yourselves, with the Claw you don’t.
I’m not denying that their damage output is often bad, especially for the HB, one of the strongest weapons in Gears of War 3. However the Lancer doesn’t account for a “power weapon”. I mean technically even the Gnasher is horrible if not in the hands of an Infiltrator.
The Lancer in particular has that insta-kill ability which makes it a great starter weapon.